Index  | Recent Threads  | Unanswered Threads  | Who's Active  | Guidelines  | Search
 

Quick Go »
No member browsing this thread
Thread Status: Active
Total posts in this thread: 76
Posts: 76   Pages: 8   [ Previous Page | 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 | Next Page ]
[ Jump to Last Post ]
Post new Thread
Author
Previous Thread This topic has been viewed 141205 times and has 75 replies Next Thread
Ingleside
Veteran Cruncher
Norway
Joined: Nov 19, 2005
Post Count: 974
Status: Offline
Project Badges:
Reply to this Post  Reply with Quote 
Re: RAMDisk

Plz call back when you have actual numbers instead of "assumed".

Well, additional file-download is 65 KB or something, so is easily done in 1 second. Startup of task can take some time, starting 7 + resuming 1 (on i7-HT) at the same time took roughly 4 minutes before cpu-usage hit 100%. Disk-usage quickly increased to 300-something MB, during initial startup, for so increasing to 500 MB a few minutes afterwards.

Not sure on later disk-usage, since didn't bother baby-sitting them. But, atleast the 1st. task hit 684 MB before doing a checkpoing and dropping-down to roughly 500 MB again...

More interesting in this run is the following:
7 of 8 used 4 minutes to startup.
Minimum run-time 10.19 hours, max run-time 12.07 hours, average 11.297 hours.
Minimum cpu-time 10.08 hours, max 11.97, average 11.19 hours.
Wasted time: minimum 353 second, max 422 seconds, average 390 seconds or 6.50 minutes.
CPU-efficiency, minimum 98.9%, maximum 99.2%, average 99.04%.

So, majority of the wasted time was on the initial startup, and while no current way to test this, atleast my guess is this initial startup will take less time "normally", when not all cores starts at the same time, but instead on average is 1+ hours between each start.

Per 24 hours a 99% efficiency will give less than 2 hours wasted cpu-time on an 8-way HT-system, so a quad should be somewhere between 1 and 2 hours wasted cpu-time per day.

Since a 3.5 GB ram-disk on average will lead to 2 hours idle time per day on a quad-core, even in the unlikely instance you'll manage 100% cpu-efficiency, you're still worse off performance-wise using the ram-disk than using an old HD... sleep
----------------------------------------


"I make so many mistakes. But then just think of all the mistakes I don't make, although I might."
----------------------------------------
[Edit 1 times, last edit by Ingleside at Nov 5, 2010 5:50:50 PM]
[Nov 5, 2010 5:45:02 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Sekerob
Ace Cruncher
Joined: Jul 24, 2005
Post Count: 20043
Status: Offline
Reply to this Post  Reply with Quote 
Re: RAMDisk

Ingleside,

WHO was talking about RAMdisk use when having 99% efficiency on a super duper I7/HT computer running off a HD? Maybe catch up on prior discussions will give you a frame of mind where we're coming from before you latched on, at least where I'm coming from is when having barely 92-93% efficiency with the present production version.
----------------------------------------
WCG Global & Research > Make Proposal Help: Start Here!
Please help to make the Forums an enjoyable experience for All!
[Nov 5, 2010 6:11:11 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Ingleside
Veteran Cruncher
Norway
Joined: Nov 19, 2005
Post Count: 974
Status: Offline
Project Badges:
Reply to this Post  Reply with Quote 
Re: RAMDisk

Ingleside,

WHO was talking about RAMdisk use when having 99% efficiency on a super duper I7/HT computer running off a HD? Maybe catch up on prior discussions will give you a frame of mind where we're coming from before you latched on, at least where I'm coming from is when having barely 92-93% efficiency with the present production version.

Well, this thread started as a ramdisk for Windows, so until CEP2 is released for windows, knowing much of actual performance will mostly be guess-work...

Now, maybe my assumtion is wrong, but atleast my assumption is that an i7 running 8 CEP2 will put larger load on the disk-subsystem than a quad-core running 4 CEP2 will do...

So, while cpu-efficiency maybe isn't a good indication, my test atleast gave conclusive answers to some of my initial expectations:
1: Downloading next task takes only 1 second.
2: Disk-usage is atleast 510 MB continuously (except the very short startup-period).
3: Disk-usage can increase to atleast 700 MB (*), if this was the peak or not I don't know.
4: Application-files is 204 MB.

This means, a quad-core should max-out at:
700 MB * 4 + 204 MB = 2.75 GB.
To get new work, if assumes not at peak usage, you have:
3 running tasks = 510 MB * 3 + 204 MB = 1.50 GB, too large. (**)
2 running tasks = 510 MB * 2 + 204 MB = 1 GB, ok.

So, as expected, on a quad-core, you'll only re-fill with work if max 2 CEP2 is running...

Meaning, only on a dual-core can you max-out CEP2-production.

As for finding a dual-core with enough memory to run a 3.5 GB ramdisk...

Even for a quad-core, having more than 4 GB memory installed is not common.

If you've got more than 4 cores (real or HT), you can't let CEP2 cun even in a mix of projects, since if 6 CEP2 start at once, you'll use minimum 3.2 GB just for CEP2, and if a couple of them starts using a little more, chances are all will error-out...

So, summing-up, my conclusions are:
a: Single-core can't fulfill the memory-requirements of a ramdisk regardless of what you're doing.
b: Dual-core can fulfill the memory-requirements, if upgrades the memory. This commonly would mean changing all memory in the computer.
c: Quad-core can't max-out CEP2-production, it will either sit partially idle, or you'll need to run with a mix of other projects. Also, chances are you'll need to upgrade memory.
d: Hex-cores and higher must be limited to max 1 CEP2 at a time, if you're not going to constantly baby-sit the crunching that is...



(*) The 2 GB disk-requirement wasn't taken-out of thin air, someone did violate a limit of 800 MB or there-around, if someone also violated a larger 1.5 GB limit I don't know. Also, seeing the long beta-phase and upload-server isn't ready before now, it's not unrealisic if they've started with the "small", "easy" wu's initially, and is planning on releasing the "big" wu's needing 1 GB+ later-on...
(**) You can't set free disk-space to zero in BOINC.
----------------------------------------


"I make so many mistakes. But then just think of all the mistakes I don't make, although I might."
[Nov 6, 2010 3:51:28 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Speedy51
Veteran Cruncher
New Zealand
Joined: Nov 4, 2005
Post Count: 1220
Status: Offline
Project Badges:
Reply to this Post  Reply with Quote 
Re: RAMDisk

Would using a ramdisk on a i7 980x Win 7 64bit Ultimate with 12GB ram be any good? My run times range from E200508_ 189_ A.25.C21H13NS3.43.2.set1d06_ 1-- Valid 11/8/10 21:50:54 11/9/10 07:51:20 4.80 121.8 / 121.3. Complected 14 jobs skipping job 15 to E200508_ 222_ A.25.C19H11N3OSSe.74.4.set1d06_ 0-- Valid 11/8/10 21:50:53 11/10/10 03:55:21 9.02 229.8 / 233.1. Complected 15 jobs
----------------------------------------

[Nov 11, 2010 12:12:12 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Sekerob
Ace Cruncher
Joined: Jul 24, 2005
Post Count: 20043
Status: Offline
Reply to this Post  Reply with Quote 
Re: RAMDisk

Works for me running combined with HFCC and C4CW. Start with running a mix and if you can set a RAMdisk as big as 6-7GB, you may have a big winner. Key is that at work fetch time CEP2 tests if 2GB is free. After, it can't care less so a work around is for instance to do a multi day fetch and then run it near dry and then repeat the cycle. Of course, some members report that the gap time (elapsed-cpu time differential) for the some I7 such as 980x is minimal, 1-2%, so then it's not worth the effort. The reported CPU time itself is no indication. Run times are all over the place for CEP2. You have to look with tools such as BOINCtasks that logs the efficiency. Without this utility it's pencil and paper.
----------------------------------------
WCG Global & Research > Make Proposal Help: Start Here!
Please help to make the Forums an enjoyable experience for All!
[Nov 11, 2010 9:42:35 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Speedy51
Veteran Cruncher
New Zealand
Joined: Nov 4, 2005
Post Count: 1220
Status: Offline
Project Badges:
Reply to this Post  Reply with Quote 
Re: RAMDisk

Thanks Sek. Is there a free Ram disk program that allows you to use more than 4GB? I'll be using a WDC WD1002FAEX-00Z3A0 7,200 rpm 97GB drive as my ran disk. I know it's huge & I can't use it all as a ram disk but I'm cool with this.
----------------------------------------

[Nov 11, 2010 9:28:00 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
codes
Advanced Cruncher
Joined: Oct 20, 2009
Post Count: 142
Status: Offline
Reply to this Post  Reply with Quote 
Re: RAMDisk

I'll be using a WDC WD1002FAEX-00Z3A0 7,200 rpm 97GB drive as my ran disk. I know it's huge & I can't use it all as a ram disk but I'm cool with this.

I might have misunderstood what you meant here, but a RAM disk is a virtual hard disk created in memory, hence RAM disk.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RAM_disk

Unless the conversation is about some other kind of RAM disk? confused
[Nov 12, 2010 12:08:27 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Speedy51
Veteran Cruncher
New Zealand
Joined: Nov 4, 2005
Post Count: 1220
Status: Offline
Project Badges:
Reply to this Post  Reply with Quote 
Re: RAMDisk

OK I miss-understood how it works, silly me. Thanks for clarifying. I have would I gain anything by using a Ram disk with 12GB of DDR3 (PC3-10700) Speed 667 MHz.

From Sek
Start with running a mix and if you can set a RAMdisk as big as 6-7GB, you may have a big winner


My thought are it's not worth it. Please correct me if I'm wrong
----------------------------------------

[Nov 12, 2010 5:14:38 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Former Member
Cruncher
Joined: May 22, 2018
Post Count: 0
Status: Offline
Reply to this Post  Reply with Quote 
Re: RAMDisk

Hello Speedy51,
My thought are it's not worth it. Please correct me if I'm wrong

That is my opinion, too. The problem is that CEP2 runs reasonably well on Linux but loses efficiency on Windows when running multiple CEP2 tasks due to excessive disk accesses and the way Windows handles Disk I/O. RamDisk should certainly solve the problem on Windows, but that much RAM costs a great deal. The cheap solution is to establish a Linux partition and run CEP2 in Linux64 on a fast disk or run Windows with just 1 CEP2 task at a time (an option in your profile / projects) or choose to run multiple CEP2 tasks on Windows while ignoring the disk thrashing and loss of efficiency.

Lawrence
[Nov 12, 2010 2:54:22 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Jim1348
Veteran Cruncher
USA
Joined: Jul 13, 2009
Post Count: 1066
Status: Offline
Project Badges:
Reply to this Post  Reply with Quote 
Re: RAMDisk

You might want to try FancyCache, which is free during the beta testing (90 days). This is discussed on the OCZ forum for SSDs, but it works on hard drives too.
http://www.ocztechnologyforum.com/forum/showt...ing-new-hybrid-disk-cache

I am trying it at the moment with write-caching only, since my Gen 1 SSD (with the JMicron JMF602B controller) needs help there. I have no definitive results yet, except that it runs OK on Win7 64-bit.

EDIT: The program is still in beta, and has caused file corruption on some systems. I have a problem now, in that it wants to run Chkdsk on reboot. If I allow it to run, I get a BSOD. If I prevent Chkdsk from running, then it boots up OK and runs fine thereafter. But that is not a good situation, so I have uninstalled FancyCache. That may be a problem specific to my SSD, I have seen that type of thing before, and it might work OK in other systems, but be prepared for trouble if it occurs.
----------------------------------------
[Edit 2 times, last edit by Jim1348 at Nov 14, 2010 11:48:48 AM]
[Nov 13, 2010 8:02:22 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Posts: 76   Pages: 8   [ Previous Page | 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 | Next Page ]
[ Jump to Last Post ]
Post new Thread